Texas Monthly Talks

Rick Perry

Interview by Evan Smith

May 2007

(Page 2 of 2)

What’s factual is that they said they’re only going to build three of the permitted, requested plants. That does not mean that they’re not going to build a plant somewhere else in the state of Texas. For instance, I would suggest to you, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if TXU goes up into the Panhandle and builds a fossil fuel plant to be a stable source of energy. One of the reasons I like the TXU buyout, frankly, is that the new company has committed to hundreds of millions of dollars of investment into alternative energy sources. I think we will be missing a great opportunity as a state if we don’t go to the Exxon Mobils, if we don’t go to the bigger or smaller companies that are in the energy development business and ask them to join the state in creating an alternative energy effort here that is bigger and better than in any other state. There can be a lot of jobs created and a lot of wealth created by innovation in alternative fuels.

Did the environmentalists who complained about the TXU deal before the buyout announcement have a point?

Let’s get down to the real issue of air quality. It’s not those plants. It’s those cars. When the environmentalists get as serious about stopping a plant as they should be about all those cars, then I think they’ll be honest.

What do you do about that, Governor?

The Trans-Texas Corridor. You know what happens in Houston. You know what happens in Dallas. In the early morning, if you’re flying into Dallas, the dark stuff that is coming up into the air—smog, as we would generally refer to it—starts along Interstate 35. By the end of the day, it’s all over that city. It’s being substantially driven by gridlock.

If that’s true, why did 25 of 31 senators sign a piece of paper saying they oppose your transportation plan?

I don’t know. Here’s what I’ve always asked of people: If you have a better idea, come to the table. Stopping the Trans-Texas Corridor is not a vision. It’s easy to say no. Republicans did it for years; they sat at the back of the House chamber and voted no.

Republicans are doing it today. The state representatives who oppose you on this issue are Lois Kolkhorst, Dan Gattis—these are members of your party.

You’re taking a little snapshot here in time. Check back in June and let’s see what has passed.

On the Youth Commission issue, the big question around the Capitol is, What did Rick Perry know, and when did he know it? There are rumors that word about the dirty doings was being circulated as long ago as 2005. Care to enlighten us?

Because there’s a lot of misinformation out there, you may want to have Deirdre give you the exact timeline. The fact of the matter is, we knew about this probably about the same time you did: when we read it in the Dallas Morning News.

There was no knowledge at the staff level? No knowledge at the agency level?

Here’s what I don’t want to do: I don’t want to say, “Absolutely not.” I don’t like to play the game of “I’m going to ask you a question,” and then you go back and say, “Aha!” You know, Scooter Libby had a little problem with that. I’m not under oath. It’s a good thing.

What I don’t want to do, Governor, is present your answers as showing you as out of touch. Unless, that is, you are out of touch.

The first time I knew about it was when I read about it in the Dallas Morning News. I think you’ll find that to be the correct piece of information.

Correct as in accurate or correct as in the correct procedure?

Both.

Because there are people who have compared what’s going on at the TYC to what’s going on at Walter Reed, where you have an agency of the federal government under the president’s control and people are saying that scandalous activities had been widely known for a long time.

But I don’t think people did know about [the TYC]. Here’s where I think you guys are totally missing the story. You have a district attorney in Ward County who was given this information two years ago, and he sat on it—stuck it in a desk drawer. That’s why people ought to be outraged. If he was given a Texas Ranger report that is as heinous as it supposedly is, people ought to say, “Why in the hell is this local prosecutor still in office?” I’m interested in finding whether we have any ongoing problems and in fixing them. That’s the reason I asked Jay Kimbrough, who I have great faith in, to come in [as special master, the chief investigator in the TYC case]. He has a record of fixing broken agencies. As opposed to [House Democratic Caucus chairman] James Dunnam, who doesn’t really have an interest in finding a solution to this. He has an interest in stirring up political, partisan, venomous rhetoric. I’m intrigued that the Legislature has concerns, on the one hand, about the governor having too much authority and, on the other, in this case, not having enough authority. Which is it?

There are some people in the Legislature who believe that conservatorship might have been the better course.

The only difference between conservatorship and the course that we’re taking is that conservatorship requires you to get rid of the board. This board did not do anything wrong that I can find. [Editors’ note: On March 28 Perry reversed course and appointed Kimbrough the TYC’s conservator.]

Do you have any theories about what went on?

I don’t. And I think that to theorize is not particularly wise right now. I want Jay Kimbrough to be on the job, getting it done, not sitting here trying to play Who Knew What When. It is very clear to me that a piece of information was given to the Ward County district attorney, who totally and absolutely failed his constituents and the people of the state of Texas. I’m substantially more concerned about that DA and his lack of professionalism and responsibility than I am about a board being given certain information—and certain information was obviously withheld from them as well.

Are you worried about possible congressional hearings on the TYC?

If people are interested in finding a solution, I’m all for working with them. If they’re just witch-hunting and partisan-sniping, I don’t have time for them.

There really is a lot going on, isn’t there?

It’s a legislative session—we meant for it to be dense. And we initiated some big ideas. That’s good. It’s like when people ask me, “Do you have an interest in the national spotlight?” I’m like, “Absolutely, do I ever. I want Texas to be at the epicenter of a lot of debates.” Not because I want to go to Washington. I have the best job, and I want to stay here in the state of Texas.

Since you brought it up, there’s an awful lot of speculation about you and the 2008 Republican presidential ticket. Are you prepared to say today that you would foreclose on the possibility of running for vice president?

Yes, I am. Not interested. If John McCain asked me, I’d say, “I’m sorry, Senator. I respect you. I love you …” Mayor [Rudy] Giuliani: “You’re a great guy …” Mitt [Romney]: “You’re a fine governor … but you need to find somebody who has a passion to be your vice president. I don’t.”

So you’ll serve out your term.

And maybe run again.

Yeah, I wanted to ask you about that. That’s come up a couple different times. There are people who say, “No, no, no, there’s no chance he’d run again.”

There are people who run their mouths off all the time about what I may or may not do.

So you’re saying—

Absolutely. The first lady and I have had that conversation. She said, “You may want to run again. If there are big issues that still face this state, if you still have the passion and the joy of getting up every day and doing this, why not? You’re good at it. You love it. You make a difference.” And she said, “As I look around, I don’t see anybody better than you.” But that’s my wife.

You’re going to break Lieutenant Governor [David] Dewhurst’s heart when he hears this. You know it.

I break his heart every day. And I might be breaking somebody else’s heart. There are a lot of people who want to be governor.

It might be Senator [Kay Bailey] Hutchison.

It might be Roger Williams, my Secretary of State. It might be Roger Staubach. It might be a lot of people. Why would I say “I’m not going to run again” when we still have substantial issues that are important to me and, I think, important to this state? I’m not exactly an old guy. My health is still pretty good.

When will you make your final determination?

June of ‘09 would be a probable announcement date for me.

Whether or not you run again, you have your legacy to think about. Just as some magazines might be inclined to speculate about the president’s legacy two years before he leaves office—

I’ve seen some magazines that have done that.

—there might be people who wonder now what the history books will say about you.

I’ll let you guys in the magazine business go get ten people to write that, like you did on Bush. I’ve only got so much time in every day that I get to worry about what’s important, and what you may write about me or what my legacy may be is not something that particularly intrigues me. I’ve got a lot of stuff to do. We’ve got roads to build and agencies to fix and health care to be dispensed and cancers to cure. And that’s what I’m focusing on.

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