Game Over 
Texas Monthly Talks
Avery Johnson
(Page 2 of 2)
Oh, I knew I was good.
Were you mature enough to say to yourself, “This is something I’d like to do someday”?
I said it at that age, but I didn’t know how to do it. I thought I would have to wait until high school to play on a team. And then I didn’t play much on my high school team. That’s what makes my story so powerful.
How can that be?
I didn’t play at all in high school until the playoffs, when our point guard got suspended. Then I had the chance to play a little bit in the playoffs, and that’s how I got recognized by New Mexico Junior College, which offered me the only scholarship I ever received. I played for them for one year and transferred to Cameron University, in Lawton, Oklahoma, for a year, and then I went to Southern.
Isn’t it amazing how things happen? If this person had not been suspended—
I would have never been able to play college basketball.
You said earlier that you moved around a lot during your career. The word often used to describe somebody who plays for lots of teams is “journeyman,” and it’s not always positive.
It ended up being the best thing for me, because I was interested in coaching and I had a chance to play for a lot of different coaches with a lot of different philosophies. I was able to find out what I don’t like, and then I was able to pick things up from great coaches like Gregg Popovich, Don Nelson, Larry Brown, and Rudy Tomjanovich.
Tell me some things you learned not to do.
There were situations in which players would come late to practices and coaches would tolerate it. There were times when certain coaches only disciplined players who weren’t the key players on the team. The great coaches disciplined the superstars and the role players. Nobody was off-limits.
What did you learn from Larry Brown?
I learned about practice from him, because he really loved it. He believed in organized practice and disciplined practice. He believed practice was more important than the game. That’s where you won the game: in practice.
Popovich?
Discipline in every way. Discipline not only in practice but in games. You can’t let the details slip by. You have to be focused. Also, he was really good at dealing with players’ families.
Rudy T.?
I learned from Rudy T. how to be a player’s coach. The players have to respect you but at the same time love you. He had that relationship.
Don Nelson?
Offensive genius. He knows how to create mismatches on the floor.
You knew Nelson as both a player and a player-coach. Was it weird that everyone knew you were being groomed to succeed him?
Nellie was the number one person who thought I had a future in coaching. He would actually take off games, and he’d allow me to be the head coach.
No tension? I’m imagining it could be like All About Eve.
Zero tension. Nellie set it up that way. Mark Cuban wanted it. Everybody wanted it. So when it was time and Coach decided to resign . . .
Speaking of Mark Cuban—whose name we haven’t even mentioned so far—what’s he like? Is he anything at all like the cartoon character the media make him out to be?
You know, he’s just a young guy who has a ton of energy and really loves the Mavericks, loves the game, loves the fan involvement. He’s a great innovator. He provides everything we need to be successful.
As owners go, is he hands-on or hands-off?
He’s a little bit of both. I don’t think he’s as hands-on as people think. He almost never comes to practice—maybe once a year. He doesn’t travel with us as much as he used to. He doesn’t come to as many games. He used to never miss games; now he’ll miss ten to fifteen a year. He doesn’t call me every day.
But he calls you some days.
Every now and then. We talk about managing people. We talk about how to take people to the next level. He never tells me how to do my job. He knows I’ve been in this business twenty years now, both as a player and a coach.
Cuban seems like a guy who has a lot of confidence in himself, and yet here he has to accept the fact that you may know more about basketball than he does.
I’m not short on confidence either. But we make it work.
What do you say to people who complain that Cuban is bad for basketball, that he’s too much of a show pony?
The Mavericks sell out every night. Our team is one of the most valued franchises in sports. Everything we do is first-class. Whenever he goes to arenas, everybody wants pictures and autographs. I think he’s been great.
What about the basketball itself? During the time you’ve been associated with the NBA, the sport has changed dramatically.
Yeah. Franchises are worth more. Players make more. There’s a bigger emphasis on discipline. We have a serious drug-testing policy now. We have a lot of younger owners in the league. We have younger players.
Are those younger players ready to be professional athletes? I’m thinking of Kevin Durant, who left the University of Texas last year after his freshman year, but he’s only one example.
I don’t think they’re ready. I don’t think anybody’s ready at nineteen to start making a million dollars, or two million, and have all the responsibility they have. They’re given so much at an early age, and they don’t necessarily know how to manage it. When I was nineteen, I was trying to pass a trigonometry test, right? This is a different situation.
So what’s going to happen to the Mavericks this season?
We’re back again, taking another swing at the fences. That’s what I’m all about.
What does the addition of Jason Kidd do to your chances?
Jason is a veteran quarterback. Not many times during the course of an NBA season do you have a chance to get one. He knows how to run a team. He provides a certain type of energy and presence that most of the championship-caliber teams in our league have. He does things on the floor that are not teachable. I feel he gives us a better chance to win.
How much of a burden is it that you lost to the Miami Heat in the finals two years ago and got bounced from the playoffs in the first round last year by the Warriors, Don Nelson’s current team?
You know, there are some organizations that have never experienced the finals. For us, that was a successful season because we had players who had never been to the playoffs before, let alone the finals. Last year was more disappointing—not because we got knocked out in the first round but because we didn’t get back to the finals. Even if we had beaten Golden State and gotten knocked out in the next round by Utah, it still would have been disappointing.
Was Cuban willing to accept the idea that you should be happy just making the playoffs?
Not at all. None of us were satisfied just making the playoffs. That’s why we took a hard look at our roster and made the necessary changes. And we’re in the thick of things right now. We have another great opportunity to get back to the finals, and we’re working morning, noon, and night.
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