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Where Texans Agree

A new poll provides some reassuring insights during a deplorable week.

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Photo by Tom Pennington/Getty Images

I’ve spent much of this week on the road, criss-crossing the state talking to Texans about the upcoming election. Like most political observers, I have some thoughts about whether Hillary Clinton was right to say that some Donald Trump supporters belong in a “basket of deplorables,” but for now I’ll just offer an observation: during all these conversations, the only Texan who brought up the subject, other than me, was David A. Jones, the co-host of Houston’s Red, White, and Blue, at the outset of a taping  yesterday.

It makes sense that those of us in the media, or the political commentariat more generally, have devoted so much time and attention to Clinton’s characterization of Trump’s supporters. But the gaffes we remember, in my view, are the ones that neatly encapsulate concerns that already existed. If Clinton loses, the “basket of deplorables” will be cited in every post-mortem of her campaign. It would be wrong to call the gaffe itself the culprit, though, in that case. Trump has declared himself shocked and disappointed by Clinton’s sweeping attack on the hard-working Americans who are supporting his campaign. The Trump voters I asked this week, however, struck me as weary or resigned.

None of them, incidentally, struck me as “deplorable”; and as I wrote in March, I don’t think Trump supporters should be reduced to the sum of their support for this particular candidate, or assumed to be on the same page as David Duke and Ann Coulter. Most Americans, in my experience, aren’t deplorable. And a new poll from the Texas Lyceum, released this week, offered a reassuring reminder that people who argue about politics on the internet aren’t necessarily representative of the public writ large.

Texas polls, in particular, often suggest that the general public is considerably more temperate, even on hot-button issues, than one might think. According to the Lyceum poll, for example, a majority of Texas adults are opposed to two of Trump’s signature policy proposals: 59 percent oppose building a wall along our southern border, and 51 percent are against a blanket ban on immigration from countries with any history of terrorism directed at the West. Similarly, Texans are less committed to partisan polarization than their elected officials might like us to be: our two favorite political leaders are Greg Abbott, whose approval rating stands at 59 percent, and Barack Obama, who comes in a close second with 56 percent.

The overarching cause of this disjunct between the Texas public’s priorities, and Texas political debates, is that the latter are driven by the small subset of the electorate that decides the Republican primary. In a sense, then, it’s good news for both parties that this year’s polls raise the prospect that Texas might one day have competitive general elections—perhaps even two months from now. The Lyceum poll is the latest in several to find that the presidential election, this year, is closer in Texas than one might think. Among likely voters, with the Libertarian Party and Green Party candidates included, Trump leads Clinton by only seven points, thanks to his ongoing efforts to turn Texas blue. Texas Democrats really shouldn’t expect Republicans to do all the work, even after this morning’s news that Dan Patrick has signed on as the chair of Trump’s state campaign: among registered voters, Trump’s lead drops to one point.

And regardless of whether he or Clinton ultimately prevails in the state, the fact that the race is this close, and that so many voters remain undecided, is consistent with another area of agreement I noticed while reporting this week: Texans really aren’t excited about their choices for president. If anything is deplorable, it’s 2016.

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  • WUSRPH

    Good news from the home front. Little about the race here other than a question of how a Trump got to be a candldate, but my sample size is too limited to give a real indication. Mostly they are talking about whether to build a third runway at Heathrow. NIMBY.

  • BCinBCS

    Erica wrote describing how Texans are not happy with their choices for President this year that “If anything is deplorable, it’s 2016.

    Cute, Erica, cute. 😉

  • John Bernard Books

    Does anyone on the dem side question how Hillary became the nominee? Of course the fix was in….its a deplorable situation.

  • Rules of Blazon

    All Trump supporters- and I do mean all- are white supremacists.

    I could care less what excuses they make. Nobody can credibly claim they don’t know about Trump’s disgusting white supremacy. Nobody.

    People can change. But if you vote for a white supremacist, that makes you a white supremacist. And I do not abide white supremacists, and nobody else should either.

    • Jed

      “But if you vote for a white supremacist, that makes you a white supremacist.”

      well, to be fair, someone supporting a white supremacist could just be a selfish, hypocritical coward with no morals.

  • Beerman

    Patrick/Trump are perfect for each other, both are experts on business bankruptcies. Two real winners…..

  • José

    Clinton said that a big chunk of Trump supporters are deplorable. Not all but many. And I can’t believe that Erica is suggesting that it’s up for discussion whether or not to deplore racism, sexism, homophobia, fascism, neo-Naziism, and violent thuggery as a political tactic. Because those are the supporters that she called out.

    • Jed

      right. or while quoting poll numbers, why not actually look at the numbers of trump supporters who *do* hold those views? because i bet it’s not less than half.

      • Shelly H.

        Both of you make some good points here.

    • Erica Grieder

      I’m not saying it’s up for debate whether those things are deplorable. I’m saying it’s debatable what the boundaries of those things are. Is “mansplaining” misogynistic? etc.

      • Asher B. Garber

        In a way, it’s in the eye of the beholder. Jewish star or Sheriff’s star? I’ll tell you what…. As a Jew, I take the Drumpf campaign as seriously as the rampant anti-Semitic messages they promote. Hysterical or unnerving?

    • Charlie Primero

      Thank goodness Wall Street and the corporations profiting from war in Syria/Iraq/Yemen/Afghanistan/et al. have the power to prop up Hillary’s corpse until election day. No way that crazy cat lady could seizure into office without their support.

      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/97c26098cac02e6244e2fff9bcda111044ab931c7541510c549bab43361658f3.jpg

  • gordo

    Nice. Keep it up. Folks who are utterly partisanly engaged in Texas should be more neighborly toward those who aren’t, Out here in Far West Texas, I sense a growing sense of fatigue toward the overwrought do or die rhetoric of the the partisans, and a growing attitude of live and let live toward political and social issue opponents. Hope it is real and hope it spreads before the session starts in January.

    • Jed

      the problem with this sentiment is that it mjsses the point entirely. one of the sides you would like to “live and let live” doesn’t have that same attitude towards many americans. the other does. your statement is itself partisan (because only one party is consistent with it), yet you fail to recognize that. and believe me, over here in central texas, we are weary of *that.* stop acting like both sides are equivalent, and we’ll stop having to point out that they aren’t.

      • Shelly H.

        Both of you are right and wrong. There are subtle cultural differences between the different regions of Texas. Many are or are becoming fatigued with this election and the rhetoric around it. The reasons vary and most of us who are moderates, whether we lean left or right, do see those who are extreme in their views as partisans driving the dialogue. And yes, technically, we are all “partisans” when it comes down to it.

        • Rules of Blazon

          I’m a right-leaning moderate from North Texas. For reasons I shouldn’t even have to articulate, I would never, ever vote for any white supremacist.

          This isn’t hard, people.

          • José

            Trump is about as immoderate as they come, so moderates should reject him.
            And conservatism values stability over risky behaviors and unproven and ill-defined methods. So conservatives should reject him.
            Trump’s proposals call for limitations on liberties that we have to to appreciate and expect. Liberals should reject him. Libertarians too.
            He wants to roll back the progress we’ve made in social conditions. Progressives should reject him.
            He is against environmental protections. Greens should reject him.
            The only factions I can think of who might find their political beliefs consistent with Trump are anarchists and fascists.

          • Shelly H.

            Other than JJ, JBB, and the random drive-by commenter, I think most of us who regularly comment have stated unequivocally that we will not vote for Trump. I have stated that I will vote for Hillary consistently for over a year now if Trump were to become the nominee. I have also been subjected to some pretty nasty attacks for my stance which has not changed.

          • Rules of Blazon

            Yeah, I know, I got you down. What I don’t get is why anyone with a brain and a conscience would even think about voting white supremacist. This cycle sure has been eye-opening. Gonna have lots of work to do.

          • Shelly H.

            I think part of it is that too many people are single issue voters and don’t think beyond whatever their pet issue is. For many, like JJ, their issue is that Hillary is evil therefore they must stop her by voting for Trump and they will ignore or deny the truth of his racism, misogyny and bigotry because he’s not Hillary. They don’t see themselves voting for a white supremacist – they see themselves as voting against/stopping the evil of the Clintons. It’s a huge disconnect of logic and reality.

          • John Bernard Books

            Can you furnish proof I’ve ever said I was voting for Trump? I believe what I’ve said was dems crossed over and helped nominate Trump.
            You dems reap what you sow.

        • Jed

          but the point is that the democratic party is the home for “moderates.” any “moderate” (or, for that matter, conservative) who can’t see that … isn’t one.

          • Shelly H.

            I’m a self defined independent. I am very pragmatic and tend to fall on the continuum as right of center fiscally and left of center socially, which by most definitions places me as being a moderate. IMO both parties have issues with corruption and why I refuse to formally join either party.

            According to the state of Texas and how they define membership in a political party I am a Republican because I vote in that primary. The only reason I vote in the republican primary is so that I can have a voice in local government since Williamson is the 2nd or 3rd most conservative county in TX. >90% of those who run for office here run as republicans.

          • Jed

            “I am very pragmatic and tend to fall on the continuum as right of center fiscally and left of center socially, which by most definitions places me as being a moderate. ”

            perhaps by most definitions. but by common sense, being on one side of one issue and another side of another issue doesn’t make you a moderate, it just makes you aware that there is more than one issue.

          • Shelly H.

            You’re a purist/extremist, which by definition, means that you only see black vs white when it comes to issues. People who are extremists are the ones who in the political realm gum up the works. They demonize compromise which is the lifeblood of governing. IMO such extreme morality has no place in politics.

            Being pragmatic, I understand that compromise is essential. Being right of center fiscally means that I along with others realize that before throwing additional money/resources at a problem/program we should make certain that those trying to fix the problem or run the program are wisely using the money/resources that they have been given. Those further to the right either want to give no additional funding, reduce funding, or cut funding entirely.

            Politics is a spectrum where there are extremes on each end with the majority falling somewhere in the middle.

          • Jed

            we can agree to disagree. for example, i don’t think we agree on the definition of “right of center,” and apparently we disagree on the definition of morality.

            i definitely think the choice to guarantee people access to things like equal education, much less food and water, is a moral choice. likewise, to be right wing is to reject that choice. how can you say that’s not a moral difference? and how can you say there is gray when it comes to that difference? you either think government should help protect something besides property or you don’t.

          • Sacagewea

            How do you define the difference between “morals” and “ethics”?

          • Jed

            i don’t. i never heard an explanation of the difference that i thought was significant enough to make a difference.

          • BCinBCS

            Shelly, your definition of where you stand politically is exactly the same as where I stand politically. I, too am an Independent who votes Republican because Brazos County, like Williamson is so conservative.

          • Wilson James

            Ditto.

  • Beerman

    Trump on Clinton’s bodyguards: “Take their guns away. She doesn’t want guns… let’s see what happens to her.”
    5:50 PM – 16 Sep 2016

    This is the second time during the campaign that Trump has made a threat insinuating about some type of action regarding guns/Hillary…..now, that is DEPLORABLE.

    • BCinBCS

      Actually Beerman it is disingenuous. Trump thinks that since Hillary wants to do something about the incredible number of gun deaths, she wants there to be zero guns in the U.S. and, thus, he wants her to see what a country without guns would be like. It’s a stupid statement on his part because, even at its most radical, no one is advocating taking weapons away from the police, secret service or military.

      • Shelly H.

        I mostly agree with you, but I think that there is a subtle threat in there as well. It’s not as blatant as his dog whistle threats, yet because he has made those dog whistle threats and some of his advisors and supporters have made more overt threats short of actually saying someone should kill her outright, we shouldn’t dismiss Beerman’s statement out of hand.

        • John Bernard Books

          Shelly we love your double standards
          “”A few years ago, this guy would have been getting us coffee,” the former president told the liberal lion from Massachusetts, according to the gossipy new campaign book, “Game Change.”
          The book says Kennedy was deeply offended and recounted the conversation to friends with fury.
          After Kennedy sided with Obama, Clinton reportedly griped, “the only reason you are endorsing him is because he’s black. Let’s just be clear.”””

      • WUSRPH

        Actually, as JP points out, gun deaths are down. That they are up is one of those “truths” only.because we want it to be or at least because those who want things to be bad in Amerlca for some sick reason want it to be.

        • Jed

          violent crime is down. mass shootings are up.

          • WUSRPH

            Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
            ——– Original message ——–From: Disqus Date: 9/17/16 8:25 PM (GMT+00:00) To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Comment on Where Texans Agree
            “violent crime is down. mass shootings are up.”

            Settings

            A new comment was posted on Texas Monthly

            Jed

            violent crime is down. mass shootings are up.

            3:25 p.m., Saturday Sept. 17

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            Actually, as JP points out, gun deaths are down. That they are up is one of those “truths” only.because we want it to be … Read more

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          • Jed

            gun deaths are down (versus when?), mass shootings are up.

          • WUSRPH

            Am in England on cell phone so I. am relying on data previously posted by JP. But accept his sources. As to number of mass shootings being “up”, is it true or are we counting better? Same with police being killed? Alleged 40% increase is over 18 for prior year.

          • WUSRPH

            Am in England on cell phone so I. am relying on data posted by JP in the past. I. accept his data. As to mass shootings being “up” is it true or are we countlng better? Same with number of police being killed? In either case the numbers are far below historic levels. Claim of 40% increase is based on actual 18 during the prior year. Hardly an epidemic.

          • Jed

            i like to think that the collective counting skills of our society (or, for that matter, the human species) maxed out a long time ago.

          • Sacagewea
          • Walker62

            Up in one quarter of 100 cities. Irving, I also question the graph because it mentions Scottsdale, AZ and Irving, Tx as one of 100 largest cities! Do the author really mean Phoenix and Dallas? And for the other 75 cities, were murders down?

            In the Times analysis, half of the increase came from just seven cities — Baltimore, Chicago, Cleveland, Houston, Milwaukee, Nashville and Washington.

            And MOST importantly, the article goes on to say “But the Times analysis shows that the rise in homicides is much more nuanced; while violence is up in a number of cities, it’s not soaring across the nation. Nationally, homicide rates are still much lower than they were in the 1990s, even among the seven cities that drove last year’s increase”.

          • Sacagewea

            “Nuanced” is an important modifier.

            Violent crime rates befan to drop in the early 1990s. Some postulated it was because of the removal of lead in the 1970s. Others described the “abortion dividend” reflected in Roe v. Wade.

            Now those violent crime data are inching up again.

          • Shelly H.

            I believe that the definition of a mass shooting has changed, and that sensationalistic reporting of those shootings has become more prominent.

            So it just seems like there has been a significant uptick in mass shootings when the numbers show that it is closer to being stable if not declining over the last decade.

          • Walker62

            Ok, but NET shootings are not up.

    • Sacagewea

      Trump is mentally ill.

      • Shelly H.

        Are you qualified to make that diagnosis? I loathe the man as much as just about anyone here, but making unsupported statements about his physical health or mental health then presenting them as facts or foregone conclusions is just as wrong as the ones being made about Hillary.

        That man is vile enough that we don’t need to make up stuff about him. Being a racist misogynistic bigot is not a mental illness, and neither is being a narcissist or having narcissistic tendencies.

        As a general rule mental illness or disorders are only classified as such when they inhibit the ability to function in normal day to day tasks, or they are deemed as posing a harmful and immediate threat to themselves or others. And it’s highly subjective in determining what level of harm poses a threat.

        • Sacagewea

          Did you not at one time diagnose him as having Narcissistic Personality Disorder?

          • Shelly H.

            I believe I said he had all the textbook symptoms of NPD and that it would not surprise me that he had it. Which is a distinct difference from stating that he is mentally ill as you did.

            Regardless, if I did state it as a fact I was in error to do so. Stating a falsehood as a fact is something I am actively trying to avoid doing. There is plenty of evidence of his vileness without resorting to making up stuff or casting vague aspersion on his character or lack thereof.

          • Sacagewea

            It is not a falsehood if it is true.

            Let’s both keep our eyes on the prize.

          • John Bernard Books

            all you 2 do is bash….you have no solutions, nothing positive or constructive to say.

          • WUSRPH

            Some of us derlnltely see him as a menace.

          • Shelly H.

            Oh he is definitely a menace. I am not defending Trump at all, I am saying that just because there are falsehoods being said about Hillary does not give one the right to say false things about Trump.

            Republicans have to make up the falsehoods about Hillary because that’s the only way they can attack her. Trump has enough wrong that it’s ridiculous to make stuff up about him.

        • waynus siez

          And with your own words we see who you really are. Your methods/themes are always the same ie: demonize, marginalize and distraction. Pick any story in any news article, you will see (maybe you can’t) the same theme. Next, look at the comment section and read the same thing, same format. YOU LOATHE those with different opinions and want them silenced. I simply listen to different opinions, respect them, and look for common ground. This “left right” thing is the first rule of war. When your enemy is larger than you, divide and conquer. BLM vs KKK, HAVES vs HAVE NOTS, the RACIST LABLE, yada, yada, yada and it goes on n on. politicians (one snake 2 heads) know this and use it, you’ve fallen for it. Think for just one moment…….why are both sides so upset over one person? He just might upset their graveytrain and put a little power back into the hands of “we the people”?

          • Shelly H.

            Really? What I LOATHE is opinions that can not be backed up with logic and facts. I LOATHE opinions that attack people and not the ideas. I LOATHE self-righteous opinions that are blindly attached to a single idea or issue. I LOATHE deceit masquerading as facts. And lastly, I LOATHE liars who spew insults, and hate pretending that it is truth.

            So who is demonizing who here?

          • Sacagewea

            Ad hominem attack . . .

          • waynus siez

            I know …….right? 🙂

        • Walker62

          When Trumped MOCKED that Times reporter with the physical DISABILITY, THAT single act there should tell you what kind of man he is!

          • Shelly H.

            That he’s a cruel and insensitive bully? That still doesn’t make him mentally ill. Unless they’ve come out with an newer version of the DSM?

    • Inquisitive66

      What Trump was trying to bring to the voter’s attention is the HRC double standard. The rules do not apply to HRC, whether it be email, flip-flopping on issues like TPP, or the 2nd Ammendment. She expects one set of rules for her and her elite cronies and a separate lesser entitlement for the general public.

      • Sacagewea

        Trump makes up new “rules” daily. You are being hoodwinked.

      • Beerman

        I66, you got to be kidding, his remarks on guns/HRC are nothing but “dog whistles” to some idiot out there wanting to become famous by committing an horrific act of assassination. Trump lives in an unrealistic reality show World. He embraces every sinister paranoid fantasy possible for headlines, and does it with weird enthusiasm. His actions will eventually carry a price.

        Instead of telling people what he will do if elected, he threatens people with what he and his followers will do if we don’t elect him. I firmly believe that he would rule our Country as a tyrant. Freedom of the press and the right to bear arms would become history under this egomaniac.

      • Wilson James

        Trumps remarks on the Second Amendment were nothing but red meat bait, much like the poorly written and edited NRA commercials running of late. You really have to be in a bubble not to discount both.

    • John Johnson

      He says what everyone is thinking and you relate it to his suggesting someone shoot her. You have become one of them…a PC’er. She has body guards with weapons; she wants to take the weapons away from the guy with a car breakdown in East St. Louis (been there). What about this do you not understand?

      • Beerman

        JJ, early in the GOP primary, I was drinking the Trump koolaide because of my dislike for Cruz; however, the content of Trump’s koolaide kept making me vomit. His recipe makes me sick, and I believe it is the wrong formula for the future of America. Simple as that….we do not need an egomaniac dictator leading our democracy.

        • John Johnson

          Then stick to the fact that you think he would simply be an “egomaniac dictator” and quit suggesting he is encouraging someone to shoot Clinton.

          Do you think (A)Trump has sold his supporters on new, radical ideas, or (B), do you think that most of what he proposes was already being discussed and kicked around even before he decided to run?

          Trump is the catalyst, not the genesis of new, revolutionary ideas. He has served as spokesperson of our group. We could have picked a better one, but none could get the message right. The others just wanted to spit out the same old, same old with a different little twist here and there.

          • Beerman

            The only “new, radical ideas” from Trump have been oriented around celebrity, conquest, supremacy, domination, absolute authority, money, arrogance, pathological lying, and turning people against each other and against the world. Some of the same “new, radical ideas” that Hitler used as tactics to rule Germany in the 30’s and early 40’s. You, and Trump’s other followers, have picked a very dangerous spokesman for your “revolutionary ideas.” Just say’n…..

          • John Johnson

            Well, see, you didn’t get the answer right. You picked “A”. You were wrong. All you Trump haters simply cannot buy into the fact that getting off high center on immigration, harboring refugees in the Middle East instead of bringing them here, making our trade laws fair, IRS reform, and poking the multinational trade steamroller in the eye are Trump created priorities. They are not. They have been tumbling around in our craws for a long, long time. He is just the spokesperson. We are not Nazis.

  • Charlie Primero

    Stupid Marxists created a Church with no means of Redemption.

    You made it evident that no amount of groveling, reparations, and apologizing can ever erase the sin of having white skin.

    People stopped attending your church, and now don’t mind being called heretical Racists.

    • Sacagewea

      Blocking you. Your foolish racism wastes my time.

    • BCinBCS

      Charlie, you’ve got some serious logical fallacies in your statement.

    • Wilson James

      This one goes into the “WTH?” folder……

  • John Bernard Books

    I agree with Michelle Obama

  • John Bernard Books
  • Shelly H.

    I agree with you Erica. The race here in Texas is much closer than what the polls show.

    I think that we are going to find that the polls are way off this election cycle and not in the way the Trumpster’s think they are. There is a service which blocks robo-calls that my husband signed us up for. Most pollsters use those automated dialers which is what this service blocks. I haven’t been phone polled once this election cycle since we added this last summer or fall since it disconnects the call after the first ring. It even stops the annoying “town hall” calls my congress critter does that are just a recorded message that doesn’t allow a response. I don’t even have to look at the caller ID to reject those calls. I still do for the ones that are done the old fashioned way – a person with a list of numbers dialing from an unknown number.

    I think that with services like that, the rise of people using mobile phones over landlines, people declining to participate in polls, and those that aren’t polled, telephone polls are going to be less and less helpful in gauging the mood of the electorate.

    I’ve had a few door to door pollsters but that has been for local school district, county and state issues.

    • WUSRPH

      You are right about how the use of cell phones has made polling more difficult. Pollsters are sdjusting, but it may take an election or two before we can assume their accuracy. How are things there?

      • Shelly H.

        Hot and humid. We are actually looking to downsize and move in closer to the airport. So we may end up in Travis county which will be interesting to say the least.

        Other than that, it’s been fairly quiet here – APD hasn’t shot anyone that would cause a ruckus for a change. There have been some suspicious and possibly drug related grisly murders in the Del Valle and Buda areas. Still averaging a fatal traffic accident a week. So, SSDD

  • John Bernard Books

    Liberals want another racist in the WH
    “A few years ago, this guy would have been getting us coffee,” the former president told the liberal lion from Massachusetts, according to the gossipy new campaign book, “Game Change.”
    The book says Kennedy was deeply offended and recounted the conversation to friends with fury.
    After Kennedy sided with Obama, Clinton reportedly griped, “the only reason you are endorsing him is because he’s black. Let’s just be clear.””
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/bill-clinton-told-ted-kennedy-obama-coffee-years-game-change-article-1.197492

    Help stop the racism in America by voting republican in 2016.

    • BCinBCS

      JBB, the hypocrisy runs very deep in you.

      • John Bernard Books

        Stupid runs deep in you and most dems.

  • WUSRPH

    That finding about Obama is certainly off from what the Texas GOP has campaigned on for the past 7 years.. Either
    it is wrong or they had bad advice. If it ls correct today it may be the rise most presidents get on their way out except Bush.. In any case it will drive JJ. Crazy.

    • Sacagewea

      Everything drives JJ crazy these days.

      • Wilson James

        It is not a long drive….

  • John Bernard Books

    Yes we know why he is known as prez BOZO
    “The Times claims the U.S. is sending Mexico $75 million in the form of equipment and training to help shore up its southern border. Ultimately, some of the Central American migrants wind up at America’s southern doorstep. Stopping them from entering Mexico is the first line of defense.
    A U.S. Border Patrol agent said earlier this year the U.S. should borrow a page out of Mexico’s security playbook and strengthen its border defenses and deport more illegals when they arrive.

    http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/US-Mexico-Border-Wall/2016/09/15/id/748502/#ixzz4KXkSR0s8

    • BCinBCS

      You do realize, JBB, that the first part of your quote has no apparent relation to the last part? Maybe some context would make it sensible but, as is, it doesn’t relate.

      • John Bernard Books

        What part of Prez Bozo did you not comprehend?

        • BCinBCS

          In the space of about a half of a dozen comments I replied to you twice, questioning your statements and you replied insulting me. It’s a shame that you apparently haven’t the ability to defend what you post and believe and have to resort to ad hominem attacks. (But then, the quality of your defense of your posts is as bad as the quality of the posts.)

          • John Bernard Books

            Rest assured I only insult stupid people…..replying to stupid people is a waste of my time but highly entertaining.

          • BCinBCS

            You are a sad, sad little man.

  • Hugh Everett

    Meanwhile, in the real world, Trump enjoys a comfortable lead over Hillary in Texas.
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/tx/texas_trump_vs_clinton-5694.html#polls

    This is the same kind of wistful daydreaming democrats enjoyed before Abbott crushed Wendy Davis. In fact, Trump’s margin might even exceed Abbott’s.

    Here’s the bad news for Texas democrats. The millions of new people moving here have jobs and pay federal income tax, so they naturally vote Republican.
    http://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2013/sep/11/steve-munisteri/its-hard-prove-public-data-500-republicans-move-te/

    • Sacagewea

      Not me.

    • Shelly H.

      You didn’t actually read the politifact article all the way through did you? And the polls are an estimate – they shouldn’t be taken as if they are set in stone. There are some inherent flaws in the polls that currently are not being accounted for. We still have 51 days left till election day, and Texas is not as firmly red as it once was.

      • Hugh Everett

        “Texas is not as firmly red as it once was.”>/blockquote>

        The Latino vote is split 50/50.
        http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Texas-Latino-vote-splits-5876952.php

        The Anglo vote is 75% GOP.

        California will turn red before Texas turns blue.

        • Sacagewea

          You seek sources that reflect your biases. Expand your search so that you can be more informed:

          http://www.people-press.org/2016/07/07/6-hispanic-voters-and-the-2016-election/

          • Hugh Everett

            My source is exit polls in recent elections.
            http://www.cbsnews.com/elections/2014/governor/texas/exit/

            There is a reason why democrat prospects are zero in Texas.

          • Sacagewea

            Exit polls from a past election are meaningless. Actual results are more valid, but the past is the past.

        • Shelly H.

          Do you read and understand what you are referencing when posting? Do you understand how polling works? Polling is extremely subjective when proper procedure is not being followed. Questions must be carefully crafted, the population polled must be carefully selected as well to avoid bias whether it is intentional or unintentional.

          It is ridiculously easy to find poll results that confirm one’s personal biases. It is why 538.org carefully selects and aggregates poll results. That is why they have the closest thing to accuracy in predicting election outcomes, they do not rely on a single poll or polls that are not rigorously following proper procedures for polling.

          • Beerman

            Karl Rove believed those same polls during the Romney/Obama election, and we know how that turned out.

          • Hugh Everett

            “Do you understand how polling works?”

            Here is the raw data from the exit polls taken in 2014.
            http://www.cbsnews.com/elections/2014/governor/texas/exit/

            Poll takers stand outside the voting locations and collect the data when voters exit. The sample is comprised of real live voters. It’s the most accurate polling there is.

            So when the exit poll says 80% of Anglo men voted for Greg Abbott, that’s an indication of how far right Texas has moved. And when the Latino vote is split 55/45, it tells us that Democrats will never have a chance of victory.

            You will be living in Solid Red Texas for the rest of your life. Poor children will be attending private schools with money that used to go to public schools. People will be open-carrying guns everywhere you walk. Fracking will happen in Denton, and every other shale play. Plastic bags will be used in Austin. Free speech will be the law of the land, and you won’t be able to hide like a delicate snowflake in a safe zone.

          • Shelly H.

            Exit polls are a snapshot of a moment in time, they do not predict anything at all. That you think that they are not only predict the future but that they are immutable is laughable.

          • Hugh Everett

            In 1994, George W Bush defeated Ma Richards by seven points, and it was considered a shocking blowout. Twenty years later, Greg Abbott beat Wendy Davis by 20 points, and nobody was even mildly surprised. That’s the political trendline the state has been moving in, and it’s going to become much more pronounced.

            Mitt Romney beat Obama by 16 points in Texas, but Donald Trump might not achieve that towering margin. The only reason is because the Cruz loyalists hate Trump so much they are refusing to vote for him.

            There is no good news for you in any of these numbers.

          • Shelly H.

            What you seem to not understand or refuse to take into account is the % of voter turnout. When W beat Ann voter turnout was close to 15% of eligible voters. When Abbot beat Davis it was just barely over 5%.

            Fewer voters are voting for any number of reasons with apathy being the most popular. That is why Texas is Red – voter apathy not because a majority of Texans are happy with Republicans.

            Voting should be mandatory for everyone eligible to vote.

          • Sacagewea

            Voter suppression tactics have been highly effective in Texas.

          • Shelly H.

            Except that it is not just in Texas and this is a trend that has been happening for decades among all demographics. I’m sure voter suppression accounts for some of the decline amongst minorities, but not all of it. You can’t say that suppression is the cause of voter decline amongst whites in any age range.

            The way we vote is inconvenient and antiquated. Going to a precinct or other assigned voting location and waiting in lines for over an hour to spend about 10 minutes to cast a vote is ridiculous inside a 12 hour window on election day. The city of Austin has made some great improvements in getting the number of eligible voters up by making voting as convenient as going to the grocery store for early voting. And even with those efforts, turnout is still abysmally low.

            When less that 10% of those eligible vote we are allowing ourselves to be governed by that same <10% giving them unprecedented power over the masses. This is also another reason that has allowed Trump to gain the republican nomination.

            The entire country needs to take a long hard look at how we vote and figure out which changes will be necessary to get people to vote. That we aren't collectively ashamed by the fact that less than 50% of eligible voters vote is puzzling to me.

          • Sacagewea

            Voting in blue states is much easier.

          • Shelly H.

            How so?

          • Sacagewea

            Look at this map. It explains a lot:

            https://ballotpedia.org/Voter_identification

          • Shelly H.

            That map is all about voter id laws. Those in an of themselves IMO are a different point than what I was making about voting. Yes they make it difficult to vote and are inherently fixing a nonexistent problem. There’s another problem, accessibility, that makes voting difficult and it’s much more pervasive and pernicious. I’m fairly certain that this problem isn’t just in Texas.

            To simplify, in Texas if you do not live in a major metropolitan area like Houston, DFW, San Antonio, Austin, El Paso, etc. casting a ballot is limited to going to your assigned and only your assigned polling precinct to cast your ballot in a 12 hour window. Early voting, if it is available, is either by a mail-in ballot or requires a trip to a very limited number of polling places and often may be only in the courthouse in the county seat and you have to know your voter info – precinct #, state districts for rep and senate, congressional district, etc so you are given the correct ballot if they have one at the polling place. In lieu of that you also need ID to verify residency.

            There are many reasons for this but mostly it boils down to $$. The state provides $0 in election funding leaving the counties to foot the bill for printing ballots, purchasing voting machines, etc.

            There are many possible ways to fix accessibility to the polls from extending official voting to a 24 or 48 hour period, increasing places available to cast ballots from, having the state provide funding and standardized ballots, online voting, etc.

            Those fixes to accessibility alone could potentially increase voter turnout.

          • Hugh Everett

            We live in a great country

          • Hugh Everett

            This is a great day in American History

          • Sacagewea

            “Plastic bags”? Is that it?

            Local control will be out the window. The oligarchs will rule. Poor children will be indoctrinated in evangelical Christian schools and everyone will be baptized or sent to re-education camps.

            Men will make all decisions for women, forcing their daughters to marry old men to pay off a debt. Women and girls will become brood sows for old men to produce more foot soldiers for the armies of the oligarchs.

            Margaret Atwood wrote a book about this. It’s called “The Handmaid’s Tale.” If you don’t like to read, rent the film.

          • Wilson James

            yeah, yeah, yeah. And A&M will win the SEC.

          • BCinBCS

            Alright now. Just wait ’til next year.

          • Hugh Everett

            Trump won…….bigly

          • John Bernard Books

            Austin may have plastic bags but what about Uber?

      • John Johnson

        Oh, the teeth gnashing should really be cranking up shortly. I can see it now…Beerman and the Professor taking to the streets screaming, “Hitler’s coming! Hitler’s coming!”

        https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/as-trump-rises-in-battleground-states-clinton-moves-to-block-his-path-to-270/2016/09/17/a77dcfc4-7c23-11e6-bd86-b7bbd53d2b5d_story.html?wpmm=1&wpisrc=nl_headlines

        • WUSRPH

          He is not smart enough to be Hitler as hard as he might try. Nor are there as many Americans who have lost faith in their country as you have. Both are necesary to succesfully destroy this nation.

        • Shelly H.

          I thought the Washington Post was a liberal rag? I know you’ve made that statement repeatedly.

          Why don’t you actually try to argue the message instead of attacking the messengers or is that too difficult for you?

          • Sacagewea

            JJ argues like a little kid.

  • Let’s just work on getting more registered voters in Texas.

    More Tx folks voting will hopefully make politicians like Perry, Abbott and Patrick a distant memory of a time when the Texas State Government didn’t work for all Texans.

  • OM

    tRUMP is deplorable, and if Texas votes for the Chump, you will be forcing your children to leave home.

  • OM

    The Chump can’t even spell Texas. That’s how much he cares about you.

  • John Bernard Books

    Some of us will get this and some won’t
    “Commissioner,
    I’ve been a season pass holder at Yankee Stadium, Yale Bowl and Giants Stadium.
    I missed the ’90-’91 season because I was with a battalion of Marines in Desert Storm. 14 of my wonderful Marines returned home with the American Flag draped across their lifeless bodies. My last conversation with one of them, Sgt Garrett Mongrella, was about how our Giants were going to the Super Bowl. He never got to see it.
    Many friends, Marines, and Special Forces Soldiers who worked with or for me through the years returned home with the American Flag draped over their coffins.
    Now I watch multi-millionaire athletes who never did anything in their lives but play a game, disrespect what brave Americans fought and died for. They are essentially spitting in the faces and on the graves of real men, men who have actually done something for this country beside playing with a ball and believing they’re something special! They’re not! My Marines and Soldiers were!
    You are complicit in this!
    You’ll fine players for large and small infractions but you lack the moral courage and respect for our nation and the fallen to put an immediate stop to this. Yes, I know, it’s their 1st Amendment right to behave in such a despicable manner. What would happen if they came out and disrespected you or the refs publicly?
    I observed a player getting a personal foul for twerking in the end zone after scoring. I guess that’s much worse than disrespecting the flag and our National Anthem. Hmmmmm, isn’t it his 1st Amendment right to express himself like an idiot in the end zone?
    Why is taunting not allowed yet taunting America is OK? You fine players for wearing 9-11 commemorative shoes yet you allow scum on the sidelines to sit, kneel or pump their pathetic fist in the air. They are so deprived with their multi-million dollar contracts for playing a freaking game! You condone it all by your refusal to act. You’re just as bad and disgusting as they are. I hope Americans boycott any sponsor who supports that rabble you call the NFL. I hope they turn off the TV when any team that allowed this disrespect to occur, without consequence, on the sidelines. I applaud those who have not.
    Legends and heroes do NOT wear shoulder pads. They wear body armor and carry rifles.
    They make minimum wage and spend months and years away from their families. They don’t do it for an hour on Sunday. They do it 24/7 often with lead, not footballs, coming in their direction. They watch their brothers carted off in pieces not on a gurney to get their knee iced. They don’t even have ice! Many don’t have legs or arms.
    Some wear blue and risk their lives daily on the streets of America. They wear fire helmets and go upstairs into the fire rather than down to safety. On 9-11, hundreds vanished. They are the heroes.
    I hope that your high paid protesting pretty boys and you look in that mirror when you shave tomorrow and see what you really are, legends in your own minds. You need to hit the road and take those worms with you!
    Time to change the channel.
    Col Jeffrey A Powers USMC (Ret)
    Vista, California”

    • BCinBCS

      JBB, I know that you have never thought about it this way but do you not see what a radical action it took to get the attention of the United States concerning the plight of African-Americans and some of the police? And even though that radical action was necessary, there are still multitudes, like you, who divert the conversation from the plight to the action.

      • Sacagewea

        My two cats can give a more cogent answer than Booksie.

        • John Bernard Books

          When you’re chuggin the gin alot seems cogent to you…..

      • John Bernard Books

        Then you approve of the radical events on 9.11.2001?
        Change will take place with or without democrats.

        • BCinBCS

          JBB, what does 9/11 have to do with protesting police abuse of African-Americans?

          • John Bernard Books

            It was a radical action…oh jeez do you need EVERYTHING explained…smh

          • BCinBCS

            Yes, JBB, I now understand what you were trying to imply. I would ask, however, how many people were killed when Colin Kaepernick didn’t stand for the National Anthem? Now do you see that one still does not have anything to do with the other?

  • John Bernard Books

    Most commenting here are arrogant bigots
    “In Clinton’s case, the reaction led her to walk away from the truth: “Last night I was ‘grossly generalistic,’ and that’s never a good idea. I regret saying ‘half’ — that was wrong,” she said in a statement over the weekend.
    The only thing Clinton should have apologized for was her lowball estimate.”
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/09/15/sorry-deplorables-being-called-racist-doesnt-mean-youre-being-oppressed/?utm_term=.9a3ffa44931e

    They believe with all their hearts that dems can’t be racist, and are the smartest people in the world because Debbie WASSUP Schultz and the DNC told them so…..

  • John Bernard Books

    How smart are democrats?
    “After more than five years in office, Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel is finally looking beyond his city’s gun control laws to stop the out-of-control violence in the Windy City. After promising in 2011 to hire a thousand new police when he first ran for office, Mayor Emanuel has announced plans to recruit hundreds of new officers to address the city’s dire personnel shortage.
    http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/15/chicago-officials-finally-recognize-criminals-cause-crime/#ixzz4KbYSkvB2

    I’m surprised it only took Rahm 5 years…..

  • old_lady68
  • WUSRPH

    Clinton got a major endorsement here on Sunday. The Observor strongly praised her and termed Trump “a fourth rate bigot.” It would be good if more Americans could read lt.

    • Sacagewea

      Got a link?

      • WUSRPH

        No. I actually read it in print.

        • Sacagewea

          Quaint.

          • BCinBCS

            As usual, Sullivan writes like he is being paid by the word. In all, though it’s an interesting article.

            I had a cell phone for about a year in the days before they became “smart”. It was so distracting and demanding at that time that I got rid of it and have never owned one since. All of my friends have smart phones and my best friend is so distracted by his that I rarely spend time with him anymore.

            Sullivan seems to imply, like he did when he was running The Dish, that the answer to life is religion. I’m not sure about that but, to each, his own.

            About two-thirds into his essay, Sullivan writes about The Enlightenment and the Industrial Revolution and how it affected civilization. That bit was interesting, informative and worth contemplating.

            The article mainly bemoans the loss of “quiet”. There may something to that. I know that I have my most profound ideas when I am in the shower and shortly after I go to bed, so maybe the mind requires calm in order to function most efficiently.

            (And maybe, despite not having a cell phone or being on Facebook or Twitter, et. al. I, too, have fallen into the technology distraction trap by feeling the necessity to comment on his article.)

          • Sacagewea

            Re-read the article. Religion was not the solution.

            I don’t use Twitter, but I do have a smart phone and an iPad. Since downsizing five years ago, I’ve converted almost all business transactions to my iPad — very little paper or file cabinets these days. I’m not glued to my phone, but texting is the only way my offspring communicate, so it’s a necessity.

          • BCinBCS

            I wasn’t trying to say that the article stated that religion was the solution, I was stating that he was implying that. He did the same thing when he had The Dish.

    • John Johnson

      By definition, you are a bigot. Most who post here are bigots.

      “a person who is intolerant toward those holding different opinions.”

      • WUSRPH

        I don’t disagree. All of us discrimate. What makes one form of discimination acceptable and another not is the basis on which the determination is made. To discriminate against a person on the basis of their race, etc.is illogical and wrong, but to do so because they are unable to make an. intelligent informed decision is only logical.

        • John Johnson

          So what you view as “racist” because of color could be simply a bias toward ideaology regardless of color.

          • WUSRPH

            Sorry, but discrimination that applies to an intire group based on a something as superfical as skln color is not logical and can not be justified. It is too general. That makes it bigotry which is unacceptable. Discrimination based on more spefic grounds might be justified. For example, to discriminate against the Troll on the grounds that his behavior is unacceptable in decent society is not bigotry. It is only a sign of an informed and logical conclusion.

          • John Johnson

            Lots of words, but no answer to my question.

          • BCinBCS

            JJ, there is a world of difference between how France treats its immigrants and how the U.S. treats ours. That is one of the reasons why there is so little violence from Muslims here compared to there.

          • WUSRPH

            They said the same things about the Irish, the Jews, the Chinese and virtually every other group of newcomers . They were wrong then just as you are wrong. Learn your history and stop being a Know Nothlng.

          • John Johnson

            Hahaha…as opposed to an I Know Everything? No thanks. No one likes a pedant.

            The Jews, Irish, Chinese and others have peacefully assimilated virtually everywhere they have migrated. Not so with the Middle Eastern Muslims, Professor. In a store, when salmonella is found, they pull every last pound until they know the problem is resolved. After all, the good and bad meat all looks the same. This is smart way to handle the immigrant situation; your option is dumb. You need someone to look after you and protect you, because you lack commonsense. You can’t find that in a book.

          • WUSRPH

            Yes, they did but only after years of discrimination and hate at the hands of people who said the same things about them you say about Muslims. Bigots never learn or change.

          • John Johnson

            No, you are wrong again, Professor. None in those ethnic groups had a clandestine core bent on doing us harm. The fact that you can’t understand the difference shows me that you reasoning skills are lacking.

          • WUSRPH

            No, they didn’t, but your predecessors as bigots beleived and said they did. After all, the Catholic aliens were going to take over and install the Pope as our ruler. As I said before, bigots never learn. Their victims change but not their hate and paranoia.

          • John Johnson

            You compare the weirdest things. Fear of Catholics? The Islamic radicals are bombing and shooting innocents. Fear of Catholics vs. We’re coming to kill you concerns. Yeah, those are similar. They warn us; they keep their promise whenever they can; you say “don’t worry about it”. The rest of us will protect you ignorant do-good’ers. That’s the way it has always worked

          • Sacagewea

            Fear of “the other” afflicts about 50% of the population. Pearl pointed out that it’s genetic – the reptilian brain is in control rather than the cerebrum.

          • BCinBCS

            JJ, what clandestine core bent on doing us harm scares you?

            Since 9|11, there have been 28 deadly homegrown terrorist attacks. Ten of these were related to Islamic extremists while the other 18 (almost twice as many) were related to right-wing extremists. There have been 45 deaths from Islamic extremists while there have been 48 deaths from right-wing extremists. Not only that, but of the 546 individuals arrested for terrorism (most of whom did not commit any violence), 63% were born in the U.S. Since 2001, only 12 refugees have been charged with terrorism crimes (vs 346 American citizens).

            Me thinks your fear is misplaced.

          • John Johnson

            You guys are going to have to make up your mind what position you want to take when trying to justify your positions. On one hand, you want to look back and use Hitler’s rise to power as justification for excoriating Trump. When I want to point out recent history in European countries where immigrants and native born Islamic terrorists have murdered hundred’s and are hellbent on ignoring our laws and establishing their own, we should not expect the same to happen here? You think the Germans wish they had reconsidered allowing the recent flow of refugees into their country? Are you blind to what is going on over there? Tell me what sets us apart? With your laissez–faire attitude, what is it you think is going to keep us from experiencing more and more violent terrorist attacks here in the U.S.? I think my bad meat analogy earlier is a good one. Since it all looks the same, you have to pull the good along with the bad to offer the utmost protection to the population at large. You just don’t get it; your mentor doesn’t get it.

          • Shelly H.

            JJ, My daughter and son-in-law went to Germany this summer and met with many of those immigrants that you claim are “hiding bad meat”. Not one of the refugees they met with were anything but thankful to be safe in Germany. All were sad that they had to flee their country to escape from the radicals. The refugees are trying to get away from the terrorists. How difficult is that for you to understand?

            The most recent attacks in Europe were from citizens not refugees. Some were first generation and I think one may have been a young child when they immigrated but was raised in Europe.

            France, and I’m sure some of the other countries as well, have statutes that can not be passed here because of the Constitution. Those statutes are horribly discriminatory and have caused a good portion of the resentment that has made a minority, a very small minority at that, of Muslims open to becoming radicalized. The majority of this small minority of muslims joining the radicals are first and second generation children of refugees. Many of these refugees have had promises of citizenship broken to them which also has fomented some of the resentment as well.

            Refugees in Germany do have a path to citizenship – I believe it is more difficult than here and we certainly have not made it easy for immigrants to obtain. We don’t make it easy for immigrants to legally enter to begin with.

          • John Johnson

            You just don’t get it. I did not say most meat was bad; I said you had to pull both good and bad until you can discover one from the other since they both look alike.

            I also understand that if you talk with refugees in Germany, you find good people. Some slime balls made it in, too. Lots of young men, in fact. Ask the Germans about it, not the refugee. Ask Merkell(sp?); she has admitted it was a mistake.

          • BCinBCS

            I disagree JJ.. Angela Merkel chose the right moral policy which turned out to be the wrong political policy.

          • John Johnson

            I did not differentiate. Bottomline, it was a mistake.

          • BCinBCS

            Sure JJ, I can see how you might choose safety over morals.

          • John Johnson

            So one can’t hold both dear? Using your tilt, we should just open up our borders without question. If someone is crying, just give them a big hug…right. Trust them without question…right? No subterfuge…right? Wrong. Glad you aren’t in charge…although we have a President who thinks just like you.

          • BCinBCS

            No JJ, when morals and safety are in conflict, you cannot have both. Your description is not how I view the problem – it is not black or white but shades of gray; the problem is analog, not digital.

          • John Johnson

            Blah, blah, blah

          • BCinBCS

            JJ wrote: “Blah, blah, blah

            Well that counter-argument is unassailable. I concede to your genius. 🙂

          • John Johnson

            As well you should. 🙂

          • Shelly H.

            It’s not a matter of holding both dear, it is understanding that there will always be risk involved and what the actual value of that risk is. When the risk has a low value and as in this case has been mathematically demonstrated as being low in value, repeatedly, by many different reliable sources, to continue to harp on it is illogical. It’s a way to justify something that you know is wrong but you’re afraid, so you want an illusion to justify your feelings, to give yourself permission to say and embrace ideas that are reprehensible so you can feel safe.

            No one is ever 100% safe. Anyone who says they can guarantee safety is blowing smoke up your a$$. SAFETY. CAN. NOT. BE. GUARANTEED. This is one of the biggest lies if not the biggest, that Trump is pedaling.

          • John Johnson

            Geez…the pedantry runs deep here. Do you ever go back and read what you write. Do you talk that way, or just write that way? Low risk value…as in don’t use a condom? You are one of them.

          • Shelly H.

            Pedantry – your favorite insult when you have no defense to what was said.

            That’s the best comparison you could make? Don’t use a condom? Thank you for making my point about understanding risk.

            Go build your bomb shelter, JJ. Don’t forget your iodine tablets either.

          • John Johnson

            You want to philosophize; I prefer to get to the bottomline…black and white. My analogies are just too simple and cogent for you; they don’t leave room for a lot of “yeah, but’s” that you pedant’s like to muddy up the water with. I repeat…do you verbally converse like you express yourself in print? Did your kids fall asleep when preaching to them? More is not better. That’s my take. You won’t get it; I don’t care.

          • WUSRPH

            Yuor comments are not “too simple” for us to believe. They are “too simplistic”.

          • John Johnson

            Here’s something that will make you sleep better:
            http://www.allenbwest.com/allen/texas-revolts

          • BCinBCS

            Well hell, JJ. According to Allen West: “We also shared with you the fact that the US Central Command (CENTCOM) J-2 Intelligence officer informed us of the estimated 30,000 jihadists who’ve crossed our southern border.

            What’s a few Islamic refugees when the southern border is overrun with jihadists? I’m astounded that anyone can get anywhere on I-35 or Hwy-77 due to all of the jihadi traffic.

          • John Johnson

            Damn, pedant wantabee, I just gave you a link with facts; maybe he went overboard with some of his other posts. How can you poo-poo this one. Please stay on subject; don’t offer retorts in the form of “yeah but’s” like your mentor does.

          • BCinBCS

            “They are “too simplistic”.”

            Oh, oh snap !!!
            (And correct, too.)

          • John Johnson
          • BCinBCS

            Terrific reply, Shelly.

          • Shelly H.

            thank you.

          • Shelly H.

            What makes you think that they didn’t speak with Germans as well?

            I got your analogy and I still think that it’s a crappy one. Especially since it doesn’t address the the fact that the problem young men have been there for decades already and were raised if not born in those host countries. If we take your analogy further, how do you plan to prevent future contamination of the good meat after you have discovered and disposed of the bad meat? Your analogy simply doesn’t work. It attempts to fix an almost nonexistent problem and ignores the real one.

          • John Johnson

            How can young men be there for decades? What difference does it make? They are Muslim and they have been radicalized. The ones who recently groped young German girls were primarily new arrivals as all the news on the incident reported. You must have missed that.

          • Shelly H.

            Someone who is in his 30’s whose parents are considered refugees but was born there has been there decades, for a second generation their family has been there decades. Many of these young men you refer to are in their late 20’s and into their 30’s. I don’t believe the context was that obscure.

            I saw the story about the NYE gropings, and again, that is a cultural difference not a religious one, as well as a possible lack of understanding or knowledge of the laws there. We also seem to have the same problem here with so-called young “Christian” American men who grope and rape young women. Yet, I don’t see older established men getting outraged over the problem here. Instead, I hear that boys will be boys and that young women shouldn’t dress, behave, or be in a situation where they could be raped or groped.

            So before we use that as an excuse to keep out refugees maybe we ought to fix our own systemic problem – MMMKay?

          • John Johnson

            What a bunch of unmitigated crap! You have your head so far up there that you are oblivious to the truth. I’ll not waste anymore time on you. You are too far “gone”.

          • Shelly H.

            Whatever.

          • WUSRPH

            That is not true. What she said she regreted was that they did not prepare better, not the refuges. Stop misquoting her.

          • John Johnson
          • Shelly H.

            BTW nice dodge of not answering BC’s question. What is this core of belief?

            I’m pretty sure that I know what you’re alluding to and it’s no more accurate than saying the KKK is representative of core Christian belief.

          • John Johnson

            It’s their core of belief I am referring to. If you like subservient women, stoning, beheading, and the like, then welcome the radicals on in. Hell, they are still into that stuff in Saudia Arabia and other Islamic countries from top to bottom; it is not just the terrorists. You just don’t get it. Don’t think you ever will.

          • BCinBCS

            When was the last time that a Muslim stoned or beheaded someone in the United States? (That’s assimilation.)

          • John Johnson

            Hell, I don’t think it has ever happened, but it isn’t because they don’t want to. You seemed to have missed the fact that most here still prefer their Sharia laws to our own.

          • BCinBCS

            And I would prefer that Clarence Thomas and Antonin Scalia not ever be on the Supreme Court but I’m not going to stone to death or cut off Thomas’ head ! (See, I’ve assimilated too.)

          • Shelly H.

            Actually, it’s only a minority that want Sharia law. And of those that want it, most only want it to apply to muslims not the entire country.

          • Jed

            you forgot all the christians who want sharia law.

          • Shelly H.

            Yeah, well they’re not getting their way either. It’s a groundless argument.

          • WUSRPH

            And most Orthodox Jews prefer the. Torah. Round them up and deport them too?

          • John Johnson

            Are Orthodox Jews threatening anyone other than those who would do them harm? They have a live and let live orthodoxy. Not so with the “bad meat” that looks just like the good. How do we know which is which? Some mushrooms are good; some will kill you. There is a way to tell them apart. Not so with Middle Easterners, as wanton carnage in Europe attests.

          • Shelly H.

            That is a cultural not religious belief. There is a difference. Culture and religion do influence each other but you can not say that they are one and the same. The fact that you are conflating the two shows that you have not bothered to learn the difference.

          • John Johnson

            You need to study up. You don’t know what you are talking about.

          • Shelly H.

            I have; both from a Christian apologetics POV as well as talking to muslims themselves. The only thing I have yet to do is actually read the Quran.

            I actually sought out opposing sides to understand better – have you?

          • Jed

            right. we should stop allowing citizens into our country, because citizens have performed terrorist acts.

            citizens = bad skittles

          • WUSRPH

            But they were accused of it. The Catholics were alleged to be working to take over, implement Canon Law, install the Pope as ruler and subject all unbelievers to the Inquisition which sure sounds like what you say about Muslims. Again, bigots never change their paranoias, only their victims.

          • John Johnson

            Was there a faction of the Irish Catholics attempting to do us harm? Did they kill thousands prior to our country spreading its arms, holding out about $60K for each of them and yelling “Come on in!”? Apples to oranges, Professor…apples to oranges.

          • WUSRPH

            Ever hear of the Draft Riots in NYC? Ask the many Blacks they murdered about the Irish. You might also look into the xIrish gangs and ask the Troll to tell you about Tammeny Hall. But your simplistic bigotry is not concerned about facts.

          • John Johnson

            Gangs fighting eachother. They weren’t blowing up innocents were they?

          • BCinBCS

            The paranoia runs deeply in you.

          • BCinBCS

            JJ wrote: “The Jews, Irish, Chinese and others have peacefully assimilated virtually everywhere they have migrated. Not so with the Middle Eastern Muslims…”

            So, Muslim immigrants arrive in this country today and if they haven’t fully assimilated by tomorrow you’re in favor of not allowing any more in?

          • John Johnson

            Did you just pick and read random posts or did you read all of the back and forth between your mentor and me?

          • Sacagewea

            Evidence suggests they’ve integrated here better than they have elsewhere. Islam is a religion, not an ethnicity. Most Muslims are fairly recent immigrants compared with Europeans.

          • WUSRPH

            Look up “Know Nothing”. It fully describes you.

          • John Johnson

            I’ll settle for having commonsense. You can’t get that out of a book.

          • WUSRPH

            Fortunately for the ruture of this country, your sense is more uncommon than common.

          • John Johnson

            So you are saying that most Americans are for Syrian refugee resettlement here?

          • BCinBCS

            Paranoia ≠ common sense
            Irrational fear ≠ common sense

          • John Johnson

            You are not going to hurt me with your insults, Professor. I grew up with tough guys.

            As far as the Jews and Palestinians, are you trying to make my point for me?

          • BCinBCS
          • Shelly H.

            Good grief and you accuse those of us against Trump as living in fear. Your inability to reasonably compare and contrast similarities and differences has me wondering if that is why your business struggled. Your inability to understand fractions, which is what ratios, percentages, and statistics are based upon…

            Well perhaps it is not an inability but a willful refusal to apply that knowledge beyond your business interests?

            Either way, I am SMH at the disconnect.

          • John Johnson

            My business struggled because radical Islamists flew two airplanes into buildings in NYC, so not sure why you want to throw that in the mix. I recovered and have semi-retired.

            You, like your buddy, often use lots of words, but say nothing…answer nothing. I have asked repeatedly why what is happening in Paris, London and Brussels, and truly all across Europe, should not be used as a barometer for what we can expect here down the road. I get nothing. I used a bad meat analogy to offer a reason why you pull everything out of the cooler because you can’t tell the good from the bad, and don’t allow further shipments until the problem is resolved. I guess you can’t see the correlation using this hypothetical. You guys are really impotent when it comes to debating and reducing a subject to it’s lowest denominator; you prefer to add-on, obfuscate and throw in references to my unrelated personal business. Now if I had been a life long government spinmeister like the pedant, or had no real business experience like yourself, that pretty much makes you unqualified to comment so mightily on certain subjects. This, however, has never stopped you. It never will.

          • Shelly H.

            Your bad meat analogy is a crappy one to use when talking about people. It just really doesn’t work anymore that Jr’s skittle example. Why can’t we use what is happening in Europe as a barometer is because you’re comparing an apple to an orange, pear, grapefruit, cherries, etc.

            I’m not saying that we shouldn’t look at what is happening in Europe but the better question is why hasn’t that happened here? Not “OMFG Look what’s happening there! We have to protect ourselves from that happening here!” the latter is the wrong conclusion and fails to note that we’ve taken in more muslims since the 1970’s of all nationalities and variations (Sunni, Shiite, Wadi, etc) yet, we aren’t experiencing the number of attacks that have happened in Europe. And our attacks combined with Europe doesn’t even compare to the what is happening all over the Middle East, Africa, India, and SE Asia.

            Americans, and the west in general has lost the ability to logically assess risk. We would rather assess risk emotionally.

          • John Johnson

            Why is it a bad analogy? I think it perfectly describes the situation. How specifically does using meat as an example change the bottomline? Get specific.

            It hasn’t happened here yet because per capita the Europeans have many more Muslim immigrants than we do. That doesn’t mean that we won’t catch up if we keep “opening wide”. We can mitigate the problem if we learn from the mistakes countries like France, England and Belgium have made. Sorry you can’t see this.

          • Shelly H.

            I explained it in another reply to you.

            And I disagree that mistakes were made. The facts do not support your premise.

          • John Johnson

            So say you.

          • BCinBCS

            Per capita Muslim population has nothing to do with Europe’s extremism problem. I know that I am yet another pedant who took statistics courses so it’s only “book learning” but I can assure you that, according to the “book” your statement is wrong.

          • John Johnson

            Bullshit. I just posted earlier today an author’s excerpt from a book on this very subject. Look for it. It poo-poo’s your “assurances”.

          • Shelly H.

            Um, I hate to break this to you JJ, but just because someone publishes a book saying X, it does not mean X is true.

          • John Johnson

            I believe I’ve posted that very statement myself, so I don’t need your schooling.

            Did you read the excerpt?

          • Shelly H.

            I did and his reasoning is flawed and biased.

          • John Johnson

            Enlighten me, please, by getting just a smidgen specific.

          • Sacagewea

            It’s instructive to Google “French citizenship requirements” or “Italian citizenship requirements” or any other European country. It’s very difficult for those born in one of those countries to obtain citizenship if their parents were born elsewhere. The societal alienation contributes to poverty and subsequent unrest. Birthright citizenship is the primary reason Muslims have integrated so well here – despite what Humpty Trumpty says.

          • BCinBCS

            Ooh, W, a two-fer.

          • John Bernard Books

            yes his unwritten comment to me was brilliant….

  • Shelly H.

    You keep trying to refute this point yet you have yet to explain why you believe it is weak. Where is the fail in the logic? We have repeatedly pointed out exactly where the similarities lie yet all you can say is that it’s unfounded or silly yet you refuse to show how it is unfounded or silly.

    • John Johnson

      You don’t get it. I’m not debating any longer. My entire reason for posting today was to gig you about Hillary’s heading south…knowing that you had to be going nuts thinking about the next Hitler’s rise to power.

      • WUSRPH

        Some day we will take a minute to explain the electral college to you.

        • John Bernard Books

          The electral college is where one studies electricity…I don’t need it explained.

  • BCinBCS

    Like.

  • BCinBCS

    JJ, WaPo is simply following “Hillary Rules”. In their quest to be “fair”, they are bending over backwards to try to print as many negative articles about Hillary as they do about Trump but since Trump lies, flip-flops ad acts in poor taste on a daily basis, it requires a lot of negative Hillary balancing stories.

  • Shelly H.

    No you don’t and you haven’t put forth the effort in months, possibly since last year at this time. You resort to either ad hominem remarks, or vague statements of contemptuous dismissal that have no basis in any type of logic.

    Where have I called you a racist? or a misogynist? Have I attacked your arguments? – yes I have. Have I attacked your logic? – yes I have done that as well. Have I said that you ignore reality and facts? – yes I have said that too. But I have never attacked your character, called you stupid, a racist, a bigot, or a misogynist. I don’t believe I have intentionally alluded to name calling either.

    Yet you freely and intentionally hurl insults at everyone who disagrees with you, sneering at us, acting superior and looking down your nose at us.

    So tell us again how you are the poor abused commenter here who speaks the truth and we are the elitists and intellectuals that are too stupid to realize how wonderful Trump is?

  • OM

    D.E.P.L.O.R.A.B.L.E.

  • OM

    176 Reasons Donald Trump Shouldn’t Be President | GQ
    http://www.gq.com/story/176-reasons-donald-trump-shouldnt-be-president-olbermann

  • John Bernard Books

    Need a refresher on terrorism?
    “(Reuters) – A man who stabbed nine people at a mall in central Minnesota before being shot dead is a “soldier of the Islamic State,” the militant group’s news agency said on Sunday, as the FBI investigated the attack as a potential act of terrorism.
    The man, who was wearing a private security uniform, made references to Allah and asked at least one person if they were Muslim before he assaulted them at the Crossroads Center mall in St. Cloud on Saturday, the city’s Police Chief William Blair Anderson told reporters.”
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/stabbing-attack-minnesota-mall-leaves-least-eight-injured-045402647.html
    Never calling it terrorism means you never have to say your sorry for importing terrorism….
    D.E.P.L.O.R.A.B.L.E.

  • John Bernard Books

    The idiots have been identified…
    “What we have been seeing worldwide, from India to the UK to the US, is the rebellion against the inner circle of no-skin-in-the-game policymaking “clerks” and journalists-insiders, that class of paternalistic semi-intellectual experts with some Ivy league, Oxford-Cambridge, or similar label-driven education who are telling the rest of us 1) what to do, 2) what to eat, 3) how to speak, 4) how to think… and 5) who to vote for.”
    https://medium.com/@nntaleb/the-intellectual-yet-idiot-13211e2d0577#.ao7dv7zf4

    The pedants have been identified….

    • BCinBCS

      There are the Intellectual Yet Idiots (IYI’s) and then there are simply the Idiots (I’s).
      (Know what I mean?)

      • John Bernard Books

        Yes I do you qualify for being both an idiot and stupid….no mean feat in the information age…..

        • BCinBCS

          Good God ! If I’m an idiot and stupid, where does that put you?
          (Is there even a term for you?)

          • John Bernard Books

            yes…smarter than you(sty).

          • BCinBCS

            JBB, you are a textbook example of the Dunning-Kruger Effect.

          • John Bernard Books

            I’ll get a second opinion from someone who isn’t IYI…

          • BCinBCS

            Just be certain that the second opinion is not from another (I).

          • John Bernard Books

            Oh I can spot you guys from a mile away….

          • BCinBCS

            Not (I) as in me but (I) as in Idiot.

          • John Bernard Books

            I’m pretty certain you’re an IYI

          • BCinBCS

            And I’m pretty certain that you’re an (I).

          • John Bernard Books

            Yes you and many other IYIs have proven how intelligent I am many times.

          • BCinBCS

            You see, you’re not even smart enough to understand what I write.

          • Wilson James

            Just block the fool.

          • John Bernard Books

            I don’t block fools I merely make fun of you

          • John Bernard Books

            or do I understand what you didn’t write….

          • Sacagewea

            Pond scum.

  • donuthin2

    Would guess part of the motive of NY terrorist is to help the Donald get elected which they see as delightfully helpful to their cause.

    • John Bernard Books

      Hillary made the same accusation moments ago and the low information voters are quick to copy…
      “Hillary Clinton: I don’t want to speculate but here’s what we know and I think it’s important for voters to hear this and weigh it in making their choice in November… We know that a lot of the rhetoric used by Donald Trump is being seized on by terrorists… We also know from the former head of our counter-terrorism center, Matt Olson, that the kinds of rhetoric and language that Mr. Trump has used is giving aid and comfort to our adversaries.”
      http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/09/hillary-clinton-weekend-islamist-attacks-trump-giving-aid-comfort-terrorists-video/

  • WUSRPH

    I have no doubt about. his totalitarian. behavior…but I still believe that, even if he wins, the American people will stop him, even if you support his effort.

  • WUSRPH

    But this time I pray some of us will speak and resist if the need arrives. Silence is to great of a crime!

    • John Bernard Books

      Did you mean too great of a crime?

  • John Bernard Books

    Yes they did…
    “The puff piece in the October issue comes amid the Democratic presidential nominee’s recent health scares, including nearly collapsing at a 9/11 memorial ceremony on Sunday and being diagnosed with pneumonia over the weekend.
    It features a photo of Mrs. Clinton accompanied by a short interview, during which she talks about fighting for women’s rights around the world.”
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/sep/13/hillary-clinton-featured-womens-health-magazine/

    They actually told little girls if you don’t eat your vegetables you could end up like Hillary……

  • John Bernard Books

    Even Biden will not serve in the Hillary admin…
    “OUSTON — Vice President Joe Biden says he plans to dedicate his career after politics to cancer research — and to do so for “as long as I’m alive” — but ruled out serving in Hillary Clinton’s administration should she win the White House this fall.”
    https://www.statnews.com/2016/09/19/joe-biden-cancer-research-moonshot/

    Joe Biden has never had a real job being a paid government bureaucrat his whole life. Told us today he wouldn’t serve under Hillary even if she asked….

    • BCinBCS

      So…?

      • John Bernard Books

        sorry but you have to pay to have it explained to you….

        • BCinBCS

          I don’t need an explanation I commented “So…?” meaning “So what?”.

          • John Bernard Books

            meaning you didn’t understand or you have given the proper response of What?!?

  • John Bernard Books

    After the bombings this weekend this paints the picture….

  • John Bernard Books

    I see it here daily….
    “Have you ever heard a progressive make such an idiotic statement you find yourself wondering if that person even believes what comes out of their mouth?”
    http://www.youngcons.com/cnns-sally-kohn-just-won-the-award-for-most-idiotic-statement-of-the-year-about-conservatives-on-campus/

    IYI…..

  • OM

    President George H. Bush is voting for Hillary was confirmed by member of the Kennedy family.

    • John Johnson

      And you think this is news? The Bush family and Bill Clinton have been slobbering all over each other for years. They both love them some Saudi money.

      • BCinBCS
        • Wilson James

          There you have it.

      • WUSRPH

        Maybe he also knows what the job requires.

        • John Johnson

          Maybe he is a father who can’t stand anyone insulting his son. I wouldn’t like it and would rail against whoever did it; ditto my wife (Cruz). But Bush has been cozy with Bill for years now. He charmed the old man, just like he has a bunch of people. He’s slick.

          • donuthin2

            The old man is still more of a statesman than trump will ever be

    • Wilson James

      Well, well. A Bush with a modicum of integrity that is willing to put his country over his failing party. Good for 41.

      • John Johnson

        Just a flock of Washington bi-political elitests holding hands with each other. They are deathly afraid their apple cart is about to be upended. I’m praying for it.

        • WUSRPH

          It is a shame that you say such things about a man who lost his office because he was willing to act to help balance the budget and fight the deficit. Your hate of him makes a mockery of your demand that others do what he did. A little hypocrisy perhaps?

          • John Johnson

            Where did I ever say that I hated Bush? Any of the Bushes?

          • WUSRPH

            It is daddy that says he is supporting her and it is daddy and his entire family you have been attacking. Fess up. You hate them all.

          • John Johnson

            If I hated them all, I would say so. I don’t hold back much. Why would I here? Go on over to East London and announce your feilty to the U.S. in a loud voice. We’ll send someone for your body.

          • WUSRPH

            Your repeated sneering at the Bushs as a group, inciuding comments on this thread, tells a different story.

          • John Johnson

            You should look up the definition of hate as opposed to criticism and dislike.

  • John Bernard Books

    If Christians can be made to change their beliefs on abortion and republicans can stop being against raising taxes dem can grow government…..what if they won’t. Will the IRS and other out of control government agencies be used against us?

    • John Johnson

      A numbers guy showed me that at current GNP, and with no added debt, it would take 32 yrs or so to pay off just $1T of our $20T debt.

      • WUSRPH

        So, no one is suggesting that is all we should do. Trump says one thing and then another, but Clinton has a specific plan.

        • John Johnson

          You haven’t watched the YouTube 13 minutes of her, in her own words, doing 180’s have you? No way to edit it or misconstrue her words. She has a plan? Yeah, right.

          • WUSRPH

            Try to find something new to say about her. You have gotten as predictable and ignorable as the Troll.

          • John Johnson

            Quit defending the indefensible. It was her own words. One day it’s yes, the next day no; one day black, the next day white; one day run, the next stop….she is a political animal. A rabid one.

          • John Bernard Books

            He’s been paid all his life to spin and protect the dem way…he isn’t capable of listening to reason

  • John Bernard Books

    Watson to replace gov workers…..
    “For instance, Watson is now being used to consult on cancer diagnoses. The idea, as Rometty explains, is that an average oncologist can probably retain a little over a hundred cancer studies which he or she can use to try and diagnose patients. By contrast, Watson effectively can access over a million published studies and correlate all of that information very rapidly to help assist in providing a diagnosis.”
    There is hope after all…imagine a world with no IYIs working for the IRS…..

  • WUSRPH

    It is not often that one can stand on a spot where the history of the world may have been determined. I did that today standing on a hill a few miles from Hastings on the spot where King Harold, the last Saxon king of England fell at the swords of William the Conquer`s men. That event may well have changed what would have been the course of all history since. A moving experience.

    • Shelly H.

      I am pea-green with envy. Although, I did have a similar moment walking the Colosseum and Circus Maximus in Rome years ago.

    • John Bernard Books

      William the Bastard, no relation to Bill the Rapist, was the first democrat.

    • Sacagewea

      Most folks from western Europe have significant Viking ancestry. “Norman” was a corruption of “Norsemen.”

  • John Johnson

    Did you read these links? “Banned all other political parties”???? I stopped after I got to that point. Just who do you think we Trumpies are? Hitler had the youth behind him; Trump has old people like me, and the working class who are tired of getting screwed; not many youngsters are going to vote for him. Very few would allow him the power you allude to; our Constitution doesn’t. Executive orders only go so far; Obama has tested this to its maximum level and has had several overturned. Think Trump could go further? How?
    You are seeing things. You are making wild, loose comparisons. Just stick to the fact you hate his ego, bluster, off the cuff remarks, lack of political correctness, and exaggerations…and stop it with the Hilter comparisons. It’s goofy.

    • Beerman

      Trump using the tactics of Hitler has been the hallmark of his campaign, and that is not goofy. It is just reality.

      And, As I have told you before, American common sense always will prevail. Whenever we have faced threats to our civil liberties and democracy, we have put partisan politics and abstract ideology aside and gotten on with what needed to be done. Americans have and will rise to the occasion.

      Trumpism will not prevail in America, and if it does, it will not last very long. People will see thru his con-game very quickly. He is only interested in fulfilling his ego with power and additional wealth. And, yes, his “ego, bluster, off the cuff remarks, lack of political correctness and exaggerations” are very distasteful to me. That is a fact…..you are correct with that remark.

      Now, I feel better with that confession, and I am headed to my swimming pool to relax with a cold adult beverage. The heat has been stifling today and I could only handle 9 holes…there is zero breeze to help off-set the humidity.

      • Beerman

        Chart on Executive Orders. Obama is a piker compared to some of our past Presidents using EO’s:

        Consolidated list by President Edit

        President Total Orders Order Number Range Years in Office Orders Per Year Period
        George Washington 8 unnumbered 7.95 1.0 April 30, 1789 – March 4, 1797
        John Adams 1 unnumbered 4 0.3 March 4, 1797 – March 4, 1801
        Thomas Jefferson 4 unnumbered 8 0.5 March 4, 1801 – March 4, 1809
        James Madison 1 unnumbered 8 0.1 March 4, 1809 – March 4, 1817
        James Monroe 1 unnumbered 8 0.1 March 4, 1817 – March 4, 1825
        John Quincy Adams 3 unnumbered 4 0.8 March 4, 1825 – March 4, 1829
        Andrew Jackson 12 unnumbered 8 1.5 March 4, 1829 – March 4, 1837
        Martin van Buren 10 unnumbered 8 1.3 March 4, 1837 – March 4, 1841
        William Henry Harrison 0 0.08 0.0 March 4, 1841 – April 4, 1841
        John Tyler 17 unnumbered 3.92 4.3 April 4, 1841 – March 4, 1845
        James K. Polk 18 unnumbered 4 4.5 March 4, 1845 – March 4, 1849
        Zachary Taylor 5 unnumbered 1.34 3.7 March 4, 1849 – July 9, 1850
        Millard Fillmore 12 unnumbered 2.66 4.5 July 9, 1850 – March 4, 1853
        Franklin Pierce 35 unnumbered 4 8.8 March 4, 1853 – March 4, 1857
        James Buchanan 16 unnumbered 4 4.0 March 4, 1857 – March 4, 1861
        Abraham Lincoln 48 unnumbered 4.11 11.7 March 4, 1861 – April 15, 1865
        Andrew Johnson 79 unnumbered 3.89 20.3 April 15, 1865 – March 4, 1869
        Ulysses S. Grant 217 unnumbered 8 27.1 March 4, 1869 – March 4, 1877
        Rutherford B. Hayes 92 unnumbered 4 23.0 March 4, 1877 – March 4, 1881
        James Garfield 6 unnumbered 0.54 11.1 March 4, 1881 – September 19, 1881
        Chester Arthur 96 unnumbered 3.46 27.7 September 19, 1881 – March 4, 1885
        Grover Cleveland – I 113 unnumbered 4 28.3 March 4, 1893 – March 4, 1897
        Benjamin Harrison 143 unnumbered 4 35.8 March 4, 1889 – March 4, 1893
        Grover Cleveland – II 140 unnumbered 4 35.0 March 4, 1885 – March 4, 1889
        William McKinley 185 unnumbered 4.53 40.9 March 4, 1897 – September 14, 1901
        Theodore Roosevelt 1,081 7.47 144.7 September 14, 1901 – March 4, 1909
        William Howard Taft 724 4 181.0 March 4, 1909 – March 4, 1913
        Woodrow Wilson 1,803 8 225.4 March 4, 1913 – March 4, 1921
        Warren G. Harding 522 2.41 216.9 March 4, 1921 – August 2, 1923
        Calvin Coolidge 1,203 5.59 215.2 August 2, 1923 – March 4, 1929
        Herbert Hoover 968 5075 – 6070 4 242.0 March 4, 1929 – March 4, 1933
        Franklin D. Roosevelt 3,522 6071 – 9537 12.11 290.8 March 4, 1933 – April 12, 1945
        Harry S. Truman 907 9538 – 10431 7.77 116.7 April 12, 1945 – January 20, 1953
        Dwight D. Eisenhower 484 10432 – 10913 8 60.5 January 20, 1953 – January 20, 1961
        John F. Kennedy 214 10914 – 11127 2.84 75.4 January 20, 1961 – November 22, 1963
        Lyndon B. Johnson 325 11128 – 11451 5.16 62.9 November 22, 1963 – January 20, 1969
        Richard Nixon 346 11452 – 11797 5.56 62.3 January 20, 1969 – August 9, 1974
        Gerald R. Ford 169 11798 – 11966 2.45 69.1 August 9, 1974 – January 20, 1977
        Jimmy Carter 320 11967 – 12286 4 80.0 January 20, 1977 – January 20, 1981
        Ronald Reagan 381 12287 – 12667 8 47.6 January 20, 1981 – January 20, 1989
        George H. W. Bush 166 12668 – 12833 4 41.5 January 20, 1989 – January 20, 1993
        William J. Clinton 364 12834 – 13197 8 45.5 January 20, 1993 – January 20, 2001
        George W. Bush 291 13198 – 13488 8 36.4 January 20, 2001 – January 20, 2009
        Barack Obama 235 13489 – 13723… 7.5

      • John Johnson

        Just got back from friend’s high valley ranch in NM (8500 ft). 40 degree mornings. Mid 70 during day. First day back here. Not liking it.

      • BCinBCS

        Where do you live, B-Man?

        • Beerman

          Up the Lake in the Hill Country west of Austin.

  • John Johnson

    Knock it off, Chicken Little. For someone who professes to believe so much in the greatness of America, you sure don’t show much faith in Americans.

    • WUSRPH

      My faith is weakened when I see supposedly intelligent people such as you falling prey to the hate and bigotry of a Trump. It is fortunate that you are still a minority.

      • John Johnson

        Chip, Chip, Chippin away!

  • John Bernard Books

    In case you need reminding how big gov creates the IYIs….
    ““I accept that it is up to you to judge my overall record, but I believe that impeachment would be improper,” the statement reads.”
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2016/09/21/irs-commissioner-faces-gop-critics-seeking-his-impeachment/

    Heheaded up a guv agency used to harass citizens. He obstructed a congressional investigation by lying to congress, destroyed evidence and it would be improper to impeach him? Yes a true IYI……

    • BCinBCS

      Once again, you did not read or, if you did read it, you did not understand the article that you quoted.

      From the same article: “But it remains unclear whether the Judiciary Committee inquisition will convince GOP leaders to launch a rare, time-consuming, and resource-intensive impeachment probe so long as evidence of wrongdoing remains scant.“.

      • John Bernard Books

        ““When we issue a subpoena, we expect you to comply with it, and when you destroy documents that are under subpoena, somebody’s got to be held accountable for that. And that starts with you.””
        I can post it it I just can’t understand it for you.

        • BCinBCS

          From the article: “No evidence has emerged to show that Koskinen directed or had prior knowledge of the destruction, but conservatives have pushed to hold him accountable by making him the first executive-branch official to be ousted by Congress since 1876.

          I think that you comprehend only those parts of any article that agree with your political philosophy while ignoring the parts that don’t.

          • John Bernard Books

            I understand you don’t want a crooked dem held accountable while cheering because Scooter Libby was convicted for lying under oath…..

          • BCinBCS

            You will literally grasp at any straw in your futile attempt to convince others that Repubs can do no wrong and Dems can do nothing right. Sad.

          • John Bernard Books

            Hell even Clinton was impeached for lying under oath….
            Koskinen lied under oath to Congress….even dems admit thats a crime.
            Stick around Hillary is next…even with Comey and Loretta protecting her.
            and Comey has some explaining to do….must suck to be an ignorant dem today.
            I know you have trouble comprehending but I’m not saying republicans can do no wrong….I’m merely pointing out when dems pedophiles are exposed and dems commit crimes.

  • John Bernard Books

    Another dem pedophile busted…..
    “Anthony Weiner carried on a months-long online sexual relationship with a 15-year-old girl during which she claims he asked her to dress up in ‘school-girl’ outfits for him on a video messaging application and pressed her to engage in ‘rape fantasies’, DailyMail.com can exclusively report.”

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3790824/Anthony-Weiner-carried-months-long-online-sexual-relationship-troubled-15-year-old-girl-telling-hard-asking-dress-school-girl-outfits-pressing-engage-rape-fantasies.html#ixzz4Kubj37Dg

    wow first Bill and his trips to pedophile Isle and now Anthony.

  • WUSRPH

    Today I stood on the spot on the deck of HMS Victory where Adm. Nelson was fatally wounded in the midst of his great victory at Trafalga, saving Britan from an invasion with perhaps as great as William’s in 1066.

  • BCinBCS
  • John Bernard Books

    Did IRS interfere in 2012 election?
    “The data show that had the Tea Party groups continued to grow at the pace seen in 2009 and 2010, and had their effect on the 2012 vote been similar to that seen in 2010, they would have brought the Republican Party as many as 5 – 8.5 million votes compared to Obama’s victory margin of 5 million.”
    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/2013/06/24/did-the-irs-win-the-election-for-obama/

    Welp they didn’t idly sit on the sidelines….time to disband the IRS.

    • BCinBCS

      [With palm covering forehead, shakes head slowly from side to side.]

      • John Bernard Books

        hahaha…you’re so f**ing dense

  • John Bernard Books

    Is Hillary consumed with rage and driven by hatred?
    “Dolly Kyle, author of “Hillary the Other Woman,” said Clinton has been “’cruisin’ for a bruisin’,” because she’s so angry and driven by rage. “People like that eventually break down, physically.””
    http://conservativetribune.com/clinton-friend-happening-hillary/

    anger can be very destructive…..do you hate the white devil?

  • BCinBCS

    JJ, let’s see what you’ve got.

    • John Johnson

      Whaaaaat? I have posted a string of emails looking for answers from your mentor. I have gotten ducks and dodges. You appear to follow the same path.

      • BCinBCS

        “Whaaaaat?” is also what I ask.
        I posted a cartoon possibly about immigrants and ISIS, you asked if that was the best that I had so I asked what you could come up with that was as good or better and you reply “Whaaaaat?”. Seems like a straight forward challenge on my part.

        • John Johnson

          Seems idiotic to me. I’m not into cartoons. Find someone else to play with. Get back to me if you want to discuss the relationship between what’s happening in Europe, and what we might expect here. P.S. Tell your hero to go wonder around East London while he is over there with a U.S. flag teeshirt on and report back to us.

          • BCinBCS

            You’ll have to wait until later in the day. One of my replies is under review because I used the N-word that describes a certain teutonic corporal’s political party that is in the title of a Ken Burns documentary on PBS.

          • Sacagewea

            That was a no-no.

          • BCinBCS

            Fortunately, they finally released it.

          • WUSRPH

            Had a very pleasant time in East London. Biased sources such as you rely on give deliberately false reports..

          • John Johnson

            Yeah, right. Want to tell me where you were? Sorry, I am not believing you. Eastern London is a mess where roving gangs of radicals are enforcing Sharia law. Here’s a good read for you. Since you like history, this might educate you a bit.
            http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/376767

          • WUSRPH

            Saw nothing like that

          • John Johnson

            Well, who am I going to believe? You or the local reporting? You know the answer.

          • WUSRPH

            Funnny, you usually refuse to believe what you hear or read. I gues that does not apply when it feeds your prior view, but only when it disagrees with what you want to belleve. What was that we were saying recently about “post truth politics”?

          • John Johnson

            When reports across the board line up, I deem them credible. When skewed biases from either side are posted, I am a skeptic. You know this, but you won’t accept it.

          • Shelly H.

            Well, I put more stock in recent updated information than you do.

          • Shelly H.

            Your article is over 5 years old and hasn’t been updated since May 25, 2011. I haven’t seen anything recent about such problems.

  • John Bernard Books

    Can the leftist media trick the uninformed into voting for Hillary?
    “In the midst of a heated but civil debate on CNN Tuesday night, host Erin Burnett admitted on her eponymous show to Trump campaign manager Kellyanne Conway that her program should not have aired a chyron on Monday’s show suggesting that Donald Trump was in favor of “racial” profiling. ”
    http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/curtis-houck/2016/09/21/cnns-burnett-admits-her-show-was-wrong-add-racial-trump-profiling

    Lefties as we all know will say or do anything to help democrats…… https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/63e09875f5e2a6a75315a5e518f7b2d66a6b7c2256ce9c6c295af029dc46b883.jpg

  • John Bernard Books

    Can they hide her until the election?
    “A look at Clinton’s current calendar from now until October 19 shows that Clinton will host no rallies and will be at one fundraiser in Washington D.C. Michelle Obama, Chelsea Clinton, and Kaine are all scheduled to host more rallies than Hillary.”

    http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/21/hillary-is-missing-from-the-campaign-trail/#ixzz4KzcfHkQG

    Will Bill stand in for her at the debates…..a most unusual election to say the least.

  • John Johnson

    I’ll not respond to the epistle you just wrote other than to say we disagree.

    As far as history goes…I am looking at recent history in the form of European problems. We will be where they are if we follow your “we have nothing to fear”guidelines. I will add that comparing the influx of WWII refugees to the Islamic extremists trying to do us harm and attempting to get into the country and wander around in sheep’s clothing is goofy, but you are too far gone to realize it. This back and forth is a waste of time.

    • BCinBCS

      Yes, JJ this is a waste of time. Trying to allay an irrational fear through a back and forth on a blog is useless. There are so many other dangers, like being hit by lightening, that are more dangerous than Islamic immigrant extremists but when one is irrational, only psychiatric counseling will help.

      • John Johnson

        Thanks for your insight. Go tell that to the people in Paris.

  • John Bernard Books

    The IRS Commissioner is a IYI…
    “Right out of the gate, Koskinen was asked about previous statements he’d made under oath regarding the preservation and recovery of emails and other documents from the entire Lois Lerner affair. When pressed on the subject, the commissioner didn’t exactly say that he’d lied about it, but did admit that some of the things he said turned out not to be true. ”
    http://hotair.com/archives/2016/09/22/irs-chiefs-meeting-judiciary-committee-didnt-go-particularly-well/

    I didn’t exactly lie but some of the things I said turned out to not be true….wha?!? an idiot.

  • Sacagewea

    A fine article from 2005 by Henri-Bernard Levy, a French philosopher, writing about his trip throughout the U.S. following the steps of his countryman,Alexis de Tocqueville . . . Note his observations of the Arab communities in Dearborn and Detroit:

    http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2005/05/in-the-footsteps-of-tocqueville/303879/

    • John Johnson

      “…return to the flag?” “White – is that by chance?” An attack on baseball because the history is skewed? A breakfast that was a little too long? Is this guy a total cynic? I was impressed with the Muslim gentleman from Dearborn he quoted. He has the right attitude. Are others we are allowing in now going to seek assimilation as diligently as he and other established Arabs are? It would seem not, based on the problems we are seeing out of Muslim enclaves in places like Minneapolis. I will offer this link for your reading pleasure.

      http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/376767

  • OM

    As president, Hillary will defend, implement, and extend smart pollution and efficiency standards; launch a $60 billion Clean Energy Challenge to partner with states, cities, and rural communities to cut carbon pollution and expand clean energy, including for low-income families; invest in clean energy infrastructure, innovation, manufacturing, and workforce development; ensure safe and responsible energy production; reform leasing and expand clean energy production on public lands and waters tenfold within a decade; cut the billions of wasteful tax subsidies oil and gas companies have enjoyed; cut methane emissions across the economy; revitalize coal communities by supporting locally driven priorities and make them an engine of U.S. economic growth; make environmental justice and climate justice centsral priorities; and promote conservation and collaborative stewardship.

    • BCinBCS

      Please reread what OM posted listing what President Hillary Clinton would do for energy, pollution, the environment and tax subsidies then be aware that those things and more can be achieved by the development of one thing, nuclear energy. But not any old nuclear energy; the nuclear energy produced from Thorium fueled molten salt reactors.

      Now before I lose those of you who hate nuclear energy and those of you who hate engineering and science, bear with me a little longer. Thorium is a compound that is weakly radioactive and is three to four times more abundant than uranium (as a matter of fact, it is an unwanted waste product of the rare earth mining industry). In a reactor one-half the size of a refrigerator, it can produce about two million watts of heat energy (when converted to electricity, it would power a typical home) without the radioactive wast of water cooled nuclear reactors and, because of its design, it is “stupid-proof” and cannot “run-away” as did the Fukushima, Chernobyl and Three-Mile Island reactors.

      Besides providing unlimited, clean energy, Thorium powered, Molten Salt cooled Reactors (Th-MSR) will solve the world’s fresh water problem, produce by-products and energy that are relatively easily combined into petroleum fuel as well as into crop fertilizers.

      It is fairly long (over two hours) but if you are not convinced after an hour then you will be jumping in your seat by the one hour and thirty minute mark. Please set aside the time and watch the entire video. The future of your children and grandchildren are dependent upon technology such as this.

      As a teaser, the following chart lists the return on the energy invested in producing energy (for example, corn ethanol produces only about one-third more energy than it took to produce the ethanol). You see, Th-MSR is in a class by itself.
      .
      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/2d351bbb1445433d90f555e5a17d6be78ddf530e4cf955865dccad65aede7613.jpg
      .
      Here is a link to a NASA video about the subject, please watch it:

      • Jed

        “Besides providing unlimited, clean energy, Thorium powered, Molten Salt cooled Reactors will solve the world’s fresh water problem, produce by-products and energy that are relatively easily combined into petroleum fuel as well as into crop fertilizers.”

        you want us drinking a byproduct of the nuclear fission process?

        nope, nothing could go wrong there …